Differences

This shows you the differences between two versions of the page.

--- eg-app-fw:meetings [2021/03/24 14:21]
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+++ eg-app-fw:meetings [2021/12/01 14:21]
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@@ Line 18: / Line 18: @@
 ------
-==== March 24, 2021  ====
+==== December 1, 2021  ====
-Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Daniel, Hosokawa, Marius, Date, Stephane
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Ishii, Marius, Lorenzo, Arnaud, Daniel
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
+     * No update
+   * 9/8
+     * Arnaud back from vacation.
+     * [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZCSvBNtmHQ | Sam showed a demo]] of AGL running on flatpak built from meta-flatpak.
+     * Discussed replacing SMACK with SELinux/None option.  Daniel needs to discuss with Simon.
+     * Next steps for App FW
+       * Need instructions for building with flatpak and how to build apps so people can start playing with QEMU as target.
+       * Make sandbox available in the next two weeks
+       * Daniel and Arnaud to work on documenting adding system level services.
+     * 9/22
+       * Sam will be transitioning to Richard Maw for their meta-flatpak work.
+     * 10/6
+       * Discussed the plan that Arnaud sent to Walt for next steps with the App FW. Arnaud will update the email and send it to the mail list later this week.
+       * Discussed how to get the flatpak run-time into the AGL build.  Scott to open Jira ticket to track.
+       * Repo for meta-flatpack is in Github https://github.com/flatpak/meta-flatpak.
+       * Initial work will be done with no LSM enabled. Scott suggested as an option that we start with SELinux in non-enforcing mode. Daniel will take a look at what can be done there.
+     * 11/3
+       * SPEC-4121 - removal of app FW from master will be merged later this week. Scott has a home screen hacked up that potentially could be added after the merge. Arnaud and Marius are working on the new launcher to be added in the next few weeks.
+     * 11/17
+       * Status update and discussion on next steps:
+         * split lifecycle into separate daemon
+         * rework homescreen and possibly merge launcher into homescreen
+         * upload for review and discussion
+         * milestone 1 can be delayed
+     * 12/1
+       * Arnaud's first patches are in review in gerrit (SPEC-4121).  Discussed whether the patches should be in meta-agl-demo or a sub-layer under meta-agl.   Arnaud will move the changes under meta-agl/.../app-fw.  Jan-Simon will set up the stub for the layout and Arnaud will resubmit the changes.
+       * Next set of changes will be for home screen and launcher daemon, then the launcher.  Those will be uploaded in the next day or two.
+       * Scott can upload changes for a number of apps within a day or two of the launcher being uploaded.
-   * RBA
-   * 12/2
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
-     * Anusha asked a question on the [[https://lists.automotivelinux.org/g/agl-dev-community/topic/fw_related_to_agl_compositor/78625117?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,78625117 | mail list]]. Discussed the responses to this.
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
-     * Marius will look at dynamic loading of the policy engine at run time so that policies can be dynamic. An alternative solution that would not require dynamic loading of the policy is to incorporate RBA into the compositor itself.  Hosokawa-san will was whether that is ok for Denso.  It would avoid a lot of unnecessary complexity since there is probably no use case for having the policy dynamically loaded.  Will continue the discussion on the mail list.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
-   * 12/16
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
-     * RBA successfully connected to AGL compositor using M3 and QEMU and can run the demo apps. Code will be pushed by Hosokawa-san.
+      * 11/3
-     * Discussed whether RBA will be enabled by default in the demo image. Plan will be to enable RBA by default.  Need documentation on how to update the policies and create new policies in order to make this the default. Hosokawa said that there is no plan to create such documentation.  If the documentation is created the proposal would be to have RBA be enabled by default with a mechanism to disable it and replace with a different policy engine.
+        * WAM Upstream changes to remove Qt dependencies.
-   * 1/13
+        * Chromium 84 to 87
-     * RBA now merged as a build time option and will run the existing AGL demo when enabled. Some open issues remain. RBA is not enabled in CI or in any build images as an option.
+        * Need to re-add Chromium and WAM after App FW removal.
-     * Documentation and example are in progress.
+      * 12/1
-     * Walt suggested that Hosokawa submit a talk for AMM that shows the demo running with RBA enabled.
+        * Lorenzo working on getting Chromium and WAM working again.  Should be able to make more progress once Arnaud's changes are merged in the next week or two.
-   * 1/27
+  * New topics:
+==== November 17, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Arnaud, Daniel, Ishii-san, Paul, Scott
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
      * No update
-   * 2/10
+   * 9/8
+     * Arnaud back from vacation.
+     * [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZCSvBNtmHQ | Sam showed a demo]] of AGL running on flatpak built from meta-flatpak.
+     * Discussed replacing SMACK with SELinux/None option.  Daniel needs to discuss with Simon.
+     * Next steps for App FW
+       * Need instructions for building with flatpak and how to build apps so people can start playing with QEMU as target.
+       * Make sandbox available in the next two weeks
+       * Daniel and Arnaud to work on documenting adding system level services.
+     * 9/22
+       * Sam will be transitioning to Richard Maw for their meta-flatpak work.
+     * 10/6
+       * Discussed the plan that Arnaud sent to Walt for next steps with the App FW. Arnaud will update the email and send it to the mail list later this week.
+       * Discussed how to get the flatpak run-time into the AGL build.  Scott to open Jira ticket to track.
+       * Repo for meta-flatpack is in Github https://github.com/flatpak/meta-flatpak.
+       * Initial work will be done with no LSM enabled. Scott suggested as an option that we start with SELinux in non-enforcing mode. Daniel will take a look at what can be done there.
+     * 11/3
+       * SPEC-4121 - removal of app FW from master will be merged later this week. Scott has a home screen hacked up that potentially could be added after the merge. Arnaud and Marius are working on the new launcher to be added in the next few weeks.
+     * 11/17
+       * Status update and discussion on next steps:
+         * split lifecycle into separate daemon
+         * rework homescreen and possibly merge launcher into homescreen
+         * upload for review and discussion
+         * milestone 1 can be delayed
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
+      * 11/3
+        * WAM Upstream changes to remove Qt dependencies.
+        * Chromium 84 to 87
+        * Need to re-add Chromium and WAM after App FW removal.
+      * 11/17
+        *
+  * New topics:
+==== November 3, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Arnaud, Marius, Lorenzo, Sergio
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
      * No update
-   * 2/24
+   * 9/8
-     * ADIT preparing documentation for RBA.
+     * Arnaud back from vacation.
+     * [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZCSvBNtmHQ | Sam showed a demo]] of AGL running on flatpak built from meta-flatpak.
+     * Discussed replacing SMACK with SELinux/None option.  Daniel needs to discuss with Simon.
+     * Next steps for App FW
+       * Need instructions for building with flatpak and how to build apps so people can start playing with QEMU as target.
+       * Make sandbox available in the next two weeks
+       * Daniel and Arnaud to work on documenting adding system level services.
+     * 9/22
+       * Sam will be transitioning to Richard Maw for their meta-flatpak work.
+     * 10/6
+       * Discussed the plan that Arnaud sent to Walt for next steps with the App FW. Arnaud will update the email and send it to the mail list later this week.
+       * Discussed how to get the flatpak run-time into the AGL build.  Scott to open Jira ticket to track.
+       * Repo for meta-flatpack is in Github https://github.com/flatpak/meta-flatpak.
+       * Initial work will be done with no LSM enabled. Scott suggested as an option that we start with SELinux in non-enforcing mode. Daniel will take a look at what can be done there.
+     * 11/3
+       * SPEC-4121 - removal of app FW from master will be merged later this week. Scott has a home screen hacked up that potentially could be added after the merge. Arnaud and Marius are working on the new launcher to be added in the next few weeks.
+       *
-   * Waltham - Discussed SPEC-3647. Waltham currently requires a private fork that is not maintained to be usable. ADIT currently has no customer or budget to continue the Waltham work. Need to decide the long-term future of Waltham with the Steering Committee.  Do we work to upstream this and have AGL maintain it or go with what is it there and potentially let it bit rot over the next few years?
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
+      * 11/3
+        * WAM Upstream changes to remove Qt dependencies.
+        * Chromium 84 to 87
+        * Need to re-ad Chromium and WAM after App FW removal.
+  * New topics:
-[[:agl-roadmap|AGL Roadmap]]
+   * Criteria for M1
+     * Working home screen, laucncher, dashboard, and settings apps
+   * Criteria for release
+     * Bluetooth, media player (TBD exactly what and how) and Nav
-   * Product readiness effort
-     * No one from Toyota dialed in, Need to discuss the future of the app framework with respect to the PR effort.
-     * Tanikawa: Current app framework is targeting a modern mobile environment for app installation and management. PR effort is thinking more along the lines of a re-using an older vision of app framework.
-       * Need to separate app management functions from a common platform service implementation.
-     * Scott: Would like a definition of what Toyota says they will drop to AGL for a new application framework after 2021.
-       * Current state of PR effort effectively freezes the project while people wait for Toyota to make decisions.
-     * Jan-Simon: There are impacts to other parts of the project.
-     * All: Toyota's Base System attempts to replace systemd. This takes the project in a very different and not open source friendly direction.  Need to understand what Toyota's intentions are with respect to their Base System and whether they think systemd will be used long-term. EG does not think the Base System is sustainable.
-       * Suggestion is that we let Toyota own and do the work for the "trial version" and only provide advice and training since this seems to be throw-away long term and have the EG develop the long-term solution.
-       * Tanikawa:  Need to investigate replacing SMACK with SELinux (or something else). SMACK does not seem to be up to the needs of a production system.
-Topics for EG for PR
+==== October 6, 2021  ====
-   * Continued use of systemd
+Attendees: Walt, Scott, Guy, Arnaud, Daniel, Kurokawa, Javier, Marius, Sergio
-   * Linux Security Module for AGL (SMACK, SELinux, AppArmor, or none). None implies leaving the LSM to the product developer.  Choosing one effectively locks in the Product developer to a solution.
-    * API mechanism. Continue to use OpenAPI or change to a different mechanism for platform services. Ideally we have an IDL that autogenerates the API code. (grpc, OpenAPI, or another)
-   * Long-term use of Qt
-   * IPC should be defined and selected.
-   * Current status
-     * Window Manager and Compositor are functionally equivalent to CES 2020 demo for Qt Apps.
-     * WAM implementation is being worked on by Igalia and should be ready for JJ RC3
-     * Marius has a number of Jira tickets to resolve but will quickly run out of work if new requirements are not defined and agreed upon by the IVI Product Readiness effort.
-     *
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
+     * No update
+   * 9/8
+     * Arnaud back from vacation.
+     * [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZCSvBNtmHQ | Sam showed a demo]] of AGL running on flatpak built from meta-flatpak.
+     * Discussed replacing SMACK with SELinux/None option.  Daniel needs to discuss with Simon.
+     * Next steps for App FW
+       * Need instructions for building with flatpak and how to build apps so people can start playing with QEMU as target.
+       * Make sandbox available in the next two weeks
+       * Daniel and Arnaud to work on documenting adding system level services.
+     * 9/22
+       * Sam will be transitioning to Richard Maw for their meta-flatpak work.
+     * 10/6
+       * Discussed the plan that Arnaud sent to Walt for next steps with the App FW. Arnaud will update the email and send it to the mail list later this week.
+       * Discussed how to get the flatpak run-time into the AGL build.  Scott to open Jira ticket to track.
+       * Repo for meta-flatpack is in Github https://github.com/flatpak/meta-flatpak.
+       * Initial work will be done with no LSM enabled. Scott suggested as an option that we start with SELinux in non-enforcing mode. Daniel will take a look at what can be done there.
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
+  * New topics:
+==== September 22, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Sam Thursfield (Codethink), Arnaud, Marius, Kelly (Codethink), Richard Maw (Codethink), James
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
+     * No update
+   * 9/8
+     * Arnaud back from vacation.
+     * [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZCSvBNtmHQ | Sam showed a demo]] of AGL running on flatpak built from meta-flatpak.
+     * Discussed replacing SMACK with SELinux/None option.  Daniel needs to discuss with Simon.
+     * Next steps for App FW
+       * Need instructions for building with flatpak and how to build apps so people can start playing with QEMU as target.
+       * Make sandbox available in the next two weeks
+       * Daniel and Arnaud to work on documenting adding system level services.
+     * 9/22
+       * Sam will be transitioning to Richard Maw for their meta-flatpak work.
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
+  * New topics:
+-------
+==== September 8, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Javier, Sam Thursfield (Codethink), Arnaud, Marius, Daniel, Kelly (Codethink)
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 6/2
+     * Asked Daniel Stone to update his presentation on app FW changes for the June 15 workshop.
+     * Flutter integration discussed. The thought is that we could do some app FW changes such as enable GRPC to make integration of Flutter simpler rather than creating a bunch of web socket code to enable flutter. We can use the lessons learned from Web Apps to determine the best course.
+   * 6/30
+     * Daniel and Simon {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_f2f_2021-06-15_-_app_framework_update.pdf | made a presentation}} during the F2F meeting.
+     * Collabora looking to free up someone to start on this.
+   * 7/14
+     * Daniel gave an update during AGL Tech Day!  Collabora has someone starting in the next two weeks on the App FW effort.
+     * For some more context here is a transcript of the meeting chat.
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes I meant, Is the "flatpack" with some other components are going to replace the "aplication frame work" (specificly in PR profile)?\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** I'd say the answer in a general way is yes, but what goes into the PR profile is an open question, that's up to Toyota for the most part. They have their own in-house app framework\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** This work is to replace the effectively custom AGL only app framework with components based on existing projects with bigger communities.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes, I agree ... I was hoping a slution without systemd but anyway ... If it provide the automotive industry required functionalities It is Ok\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I know replacing systemd custom lots of resources ... With this solution AGL will looks like a custom desktop distro (But I am agree it will have more functionalities and easy to develop)\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** To be more specific, we wrote a small doc about how to use the layer here: https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/blob/AGL/AGL.md\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Currently the AFB v4 is in "redpesk" repo, but the with different licences ... I was planing to contribute to v4 and back port It to AGL ... but I think It won't be possible when we consider licencing issue\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** There are some lack of functionalities and policy managment issue in current application frame work ... We wrote an additional service top on AFM to fulfill some requiremnts in real word Infotainment system.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I was planing to push some features in current application frame work but with new situation, we have to re-learn AGL :))\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** https://docs.flatpak.org/en/latest/electron.html\\'
+     * Javier said that they now have meta-flatpak building and running! Repo is available in [[https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/tree/AGL | Gitlab]]
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
+     * No update
+   * 9/8
+     * Arnaud back from vacation.
+     * [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZCSvBNtmHQ | Sam showed a demo]] of AGL running on flatpak built from meta-flatpak.
+     * Discussed replacing SMACK with SELinux/None option.  Daniel needs to discuss with Simon.
+     * Next steps for App FW
+       * Need instructions for building with flatpak and how to build apps so people can start playing with QEMU as target.
+       * Make sandbox available in the next two weeks
+       * Daniel and Arnaud to work on documenting adding system level services.
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
+  * New topics:
+==== August 11, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Marius, Lorenzo, Javier
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 6/2
+     * Asked Daniel Stone to update his presentation on app FW changes for the June 15 workshop.
+     * Flutter integration discussed. The thought is that we could do some app FW changes such as enable GRPC to make integration of Flutter simpler rather than creating a bunch of web socket code to enable flutter. We can use the lessons learned from Web Apps to determine the best course.
+   * 6/30
+     * Daniel and Simon {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_f2f_2021-06-15_-_app_framework_update.pdf | made a presentation}} during the F2F meeting.
+     * Collabora looking to free up someone to start on this.
+   * 7/14
+     * Daniel gave an update during AGL Tech Day!  Collabora has someone starting in the next two weeks on the App FW effort.
+     * For some more context here is a transcript of the meeting chat.
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes I meant, Is the "flatpack" with some other components are going to replace the "aplication frame work" (specificly in PR profile)?\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** I'd say the answer in a general way is yes, but what goes into the PR profile is an open question, that's up to Toyota for the most part. They have their own in-house app framework\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** This work is to replace the effectively custom AGL only app framework with components based on existing projects with bigger communities.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes, I agree ... I was hoping a slution without systemd but anyway ... If it provide the automotive industry required functionalities It is Ok\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I know replacing systemd custom lots of resources ... With this solution AGL will looks like a custom desktop distro (But I am agree it will have more functionalities and easy to develop)\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** To be more specific, we wrote a small doc about how to use the layer here: https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/blob/AGL/AGL.md\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Currently the AFB v4 is in "redpesk" repo, but the with different licences ... I was planing to contribute to v4 and back port It to AGL ... but I think It won't be possible when we consider licencing issue\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** There are some lack of functionalities and policy managment issue in current application frame work ... We wrote an additional service top on AFM to fulfill some requiremnts in real word Infotainment system.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I was planing to push some features in current application frame work but with new situation, we have to re-learn AGL :))\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** https://docs.flatpak.org/en/latest/electron.html\\'
+     * Javier said that they now have meta-flatpak building and running! Repo is available in [[https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/tree/AGL | Gitlab]]
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+   * 8/11
+     * No update
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+      * 8/11 - Work ongoing on the launcher and UI part of hvac .
+  * New topics:
+    *
+==== July 28, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Javier, Marius, Daniel, Arnaud (Collabora), Lorenzo
+**Application Framework Redesign**
+   * 6/2
+     * Asked Daniel Stone to update his presentation on app FW changes for the June 15 workshop.
+     * Flutter integration discussed. The thought is that we could do some app FW changes such as enable GRPC to make integration of Flutter simpler rather than creating a bunch of web socket code to enable flutter. We can use the lessons learned from Web Apps to determine the best course.
+   * 6/30
+     * Daniel and Simon {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_f2f_2021-06-15_-_app_framework_update.pdf | made a presentation}} during the F2F meeting.
+     * Collabora looking to free up someone to start on this.
+   * 7/14
+     * Daniel gave an update during AGL Tech Day!  Collabora has someone starting in the next two weeks on the App FW effort.
+     * For some more context here is a transcript of the meeting chat.
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes I meant, Is the "flatpack" with some other components are going to replace the "aplication frame work" (specificly in PR profile)?\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** I'd say the answer in a general way is yes, but what goes into the PR profile is an open question, that's up to Toyota for the most part. They have their own in-house app framework\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** This work is to replace the effectively custom AGL only app framework with components based on existing projects with bigger communities.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes, I agree ... I was hoping a slution without systemd but anyway ... If it provide the automotive industry required functionalities It is Ok\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I know replacing systemd custom lots of resources ... With this solution AGL will looks like a custom desktop distro (But I am agree it will have more functionalities and easy to develop)\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** To be more specific, we wrote a small doc about how to use the layer here: https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/blob/AGL/AGL.md\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Currently the AFB v4 is in "redpesk" repo, but the with different licences ... I was planing to contribute to v4 and back port It to AGL ... but I think It won't be possible when we consider licencing issue\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** There are some lack of functionalities and policy managment issue in current application frame work ... We wrote an additional service top on AFM to fulfill some requiremnts in real word Infotainment system.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I was planing to push some features in current application frame work but with new situation, we have to re-learn AGL :))\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** https://docs.flatpak.org/en/latest/electron.html\\'
+     * Javier said that they now have meta-flatpak building and running! Repo is available in [[https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/tree/AGL | Gitlab]]
+   * 7/28
+     * Arnaud introduced himself as a new member of the team looking at Application Framework topics. Started looking at building flatpak and the work started by Codethink. The engineer working on this at Codethink moved on to another project. Javier is hoping to find someone else to look it.
+     * Need to think about where the code will reside long-term.  Is there an upstream project we can give this (YP, oe, meta-virtualization, RedHat).
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+  * New topics:
+==== July 14, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Marius, Daniel, Javier, Farshid, George
+   * 6/2
+     * Asked Daniel Stone to update his presentation on app FW changes for the June 15 workshop.
+     * Flutter integration discussed. The thought is that we could do some app FW changes such as enable GRPC to make integration of Flutter simpler rather than creating a bunch of web socket code to enable flutter. We can use the lessons learned from Web Apps to determine the best course.
+   * 6/30
+     * Daniel and Simon {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_f2f_2021-06-15_-_app_framework_update.pdf | made a presentation}} during the F2F meeting.
+     * Collabora looking to free up someone to start on this.
+   * 7/14
+     * Daniel gave an update during AGL Tech Day!  Collabora has someone starting in the next two weeks on the App FW effort.
+     * For some more context here is a transcript of the meeting chat.
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes I meant, Is the "flatpack" with some other components are going to replace the "aplication frame work" (specificly in PR profile)?\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** I'd say the answer in a general way is yes, but what goes into the PR profile is an open question, that's up to Toyota for the most part. They have their own in-house app framework\\
+**From Scott Murray to Everyone :** This work is to replace the effectively custom AGL only app framework with components based on existing projects with bigger communities.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Yes, I agree ... I was hoping a slution without systemd but anyway ... If it provide the automotive industry required functionalities It is Ok\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I know replacing systemd custom lots of resources ... With this solution AGL will looks like a custom desktop distro (But I am agree it will have more functionalities and easy to develop)\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** To be more specific, we wrote a small doc about how to use the layer here: https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/blob/AGL/AGL.md\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** Currently the AFB v4 is in "redpesk" repo, but the with different licences ... I was planing to contribute to v4 and back port It to AGL ... but I think It won't be possible when we consider licencing issue\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** There are some lack of functionalities and policy managment issue in current application frame work ... We wrote an additional service top on AFM to fulfill some requiremnts in real word Infotainment system.\\
+**From Farshid Monhaseri to Everyone :** I was planing to push some features in current application frame work but with new situation, we have to re-learn AGL :))\\
+**From Javier Jardón to Everyone :** https://docs.flatpak.org/en/latest/electron.html\\
+     * Javier said that they now have meta-flatpak building and running! Repo is available in [[https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/tree/AGL | Gitlab]]
+    * WAM and Flutter (SPEC-3876)
+      * 6/30 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+      * 7/14 - [[https://confluence.automotivelinux.org/x/_ACsAg | Confluence page]] was created by Lorenzo and Roger.
+  * New topics:
+==== June 30, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Hosokawa, Scott. Lorenzo, Marius
+   * 6/2
+     * Asked Daniel Stone to update his presentation on app FW changes for the June 15 workshop.
+     * Flutter integration discussed. The thought is that we could do some app FW changes such as enable GRPC to make integration of Flutter simpler rather than creating a bunch of web socket code to enable flutter. We can use the lessons learned from Web Apps to determine the best course.
+   * 6/30
+     * Daniel and Simon {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_f2f_2021-06-15_-_app_framework_update.pdf | made a presentation}} during the F2F meeting.
+     * Collabora looking to free up someone to start on this.
+   * 4/4 - Reviewed the [[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WsFPh_-2wAYE8NvKlBGywYixhhJz9EBlbUR02r0UWF8/edit?usp=sharing | roadmap spreadsheet]] and added the tab "Copy of App FW and Security" to further refine and group the tasks.
+     * {{ :eg-app-fw:wam_cef.pdf |Presentation on Web Apps and CEF}} by Lorenzo
+     * {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_sat_2021-03-18_-_app_framework.pdf  | Presentation from Daniel}} on App FW rework
+   * 5/19 - Lorenzo presented at the Webengines Hackfest Embedded Session [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABb4IoSGeWs  | link]]
+   * 4/11 - CodeThink joined the called and they are interested in participating in flatpak development. Javier also commented that they are in favor of Daniel's proposal to more closely follow upstream for the App FW.
+     * AWS main concern is security model using SMACK and the current AGL documentation makes it very difficult to develop new apps outside of the AGL demo apps. Would like the focus of new security model and App FW to be on the developer experience and making it easier to develop and deploy new apps.
+     * Richard suggested that we build a tutorial on how to develop apps be created in parallel with the development effort.
+     * Need to think about how we can use flatpak and SELinux can co-exist and create an easy developer experience.
+   * 5/19 - Javier: waiting for appfw/Collabora progress. Meanwhile looking into core integration of flatpack into YP (updating support there)
+   * 6/2
+     * Javier - [[ https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/tree/coldtom/update | updated the generic Yocto flatpak recipe]] and verified that it works. Will need to try building with AGL next.
+   * 6/30
+     * No update on meta-flatpak other than it builds.
+  * New topics:
+    * SPEC-3876 - Lorenzo gave us an update on their work creating Flutter apps that run via WAM. Asked if he could provide a diagram in Confluence on what they are doing with an eye towards how we can resume the apps and other work once we move to Flutter embedder or other non-web based solution.
+==== June 2, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Scott, Hosokawa, Marius, Bernard, Javier
+   * 6/2
+     * Asked Daniel Stone to update his presentation on app FW changes for the June 15 workshop.
+     * Flutter integration discussed. The thought is that we could do some app FW changes such as enable GRPC to make integration of Flutter simpler rather than creating a bunch of web socket code to enable flutter. We can use the lessons learned from Web Apps to determine the best course.
+   * 4/4 - Reviewed the [[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WsFPh_-2wAYE8NvKlBGywYixhhJz9EBlbUR02r0UWF8/edit?usp=sharing | roadmap spreadsheet]] and added the tab "Copy of App FW and Security" to further refine and group the tasks.
+     * {{ :eg-app-fw:wam_cef.pdf |Presentation on Web Apps and CEF}} by Lorenzo
+     * {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_sat_2021-03-18_-_app_framework.pdf  | Presentation from Daniel}} on App FW rework
+   * 5/19 - Lorenzo presented at the Webengines Hackfest Embedded Session [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABb4IoSGeWs  | link]]
+   * 4/11 - CodeThink joined the called and they are interested in participating in flatpak development. Javier also commented that they are in favor of Daniel's proposal to more closely follow upstream for the App FW.
+     * AWS main concern is security model using SMACK and the current AGL documentation makes it very difficult to develop new apps outside of the AGL demo apps. Would like the focus of new security model and App FW to be on the developer experience and making it easier to develop and deploy new apps.
+     * Richard suggested that we build a tutorial on how to develop apps be created in parallel with the development effort.
+     * Need to think about how we can use flatpak and SELinux can co-exist and create an easy developer experience.
+   * 5/19 - Javier: waiting for appfw/Collabora progress. Meanwhile looking into core integration of flatpack into YP (updating support there)
+   * 6/2
+     * Javier - [[ https://gitlab.com/CodethinkLabs/agl/meta-flatpak/-/tree/coldtom/update | updated the generic Yocto flatpack recipe]] and verified that it works. Will need to try building with AGL next.
+  * New topics:
+==== May 19, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Jan-Simon, Scott, Javier, Lorenzo, Marius
+   * 4/4 - Reviewed the [[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WsFPh_-2wAYE8NvKlBGywYixhhJz9EBlbUR02r0UWF8/edit?usp=sharing | roadmap spreadsheet]] and added the tab "Copy of App FW and Security" to further refine and group the tasks.
+     * {{ :eg-app-fw:wam_cef.pdf |Presentation on Web Apps and CEF}} by Lorenzo
+     * {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_sat_2021-03-18_-_app_framework.pdf  | Presentation from Daniel}} on App FW rework
+   * 5/19 - Lorenzo presented at the Webengines Hackfest Embedded Session [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABb4IoSGeWs  | link]]
+   * 4/11 - CodeThink joined the called and they are interested in participating in flatpak development. Javier also commented that they are in favor of Daniel's proposal to more closely follow upstream for the App FW.
+     * AWS main concern is security model using SMACK and the current AGL documentation makes it very difficult to develop new apps outside of the AGL demo apps. Would like the focus of new security model and App FW to be on the developer experience and making it easier to develop and deploy new apps.
+     * Richard suggested that we build a tutorial on how to develop apps be created in parallel with the development effort.
+     * Need to think about how we can use flatpak and SELinux can co-exist and create an easy developer experience.
+   * 5/19 - Javier: waiting for appfw/Collabora progress. Meanwhile looking into core integration of flatpack into YP (updating support there)
+  * New topics:
+    * Marius: Development environment for application developer use-case is currently difficult to use. Need to reconsider with new appfw.
+==== April 21, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt,  Javier Jardon and Mark Green (Codethink), Hosokawa, Yamaguchi, Marius, Scott, Date, Kurokawa, Richard
+   * 4/4 - Reviewed the [[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WsFPh_-2wAYE8NvKlBGywYixhhJz9EBlbUR02r0UWF8/edit?usp=sharing | roadmap spreadsheet]] and added the tab "Copy of App FW and Security" to further refine and group the tasks.
+   * {{ :eg-app-fw:wam_cef.pdf |Presentation on Web Apps and CEF}} by Lorenzo
+   * {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_sat_2021-03-18_-_app_framework.pdf  | Presentation from Daniel}} on App FW rework
+   * 4/11 - CodeThink joined the called and they are interested in participating in flatpak development. Javier also commented that they are in favor of Daniel's proposal to more closely follow upstream for the App FW.
+   * AWS main concern is security model using SMACK and the current AGL documentation makes it very difficult to develop new apps outside of the AGL demo apps. Would like the focus of new security model and App FW to be on the developer experience and making it easier to develop and deploy new apps.
+   * Richard suggested that we build a tutorial on how to develop apps be created in parallel with the development effort.
+   * Need to think about how we can use flatpak and SELinux can co-exist and create an easy developer experience.
+  * New topics:
+==== April 7, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Hosokawa, Scott, Date, Richard, Lorenzo,
+   * Reviewed the [[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WsFPh_-2wAYE8NvKlBGywYixhhJz9EBlbUR02r0UWF8/edit?usp=sharing | roadmap spreadsheet]] and added the tab "Copy of App FW and Security" to further refine and group the tasks.
+   * {{ :eg-app-fw:wam_cef.pdf |Presentation on Web Apps and CEF}} by Lorenzo
+   * {{ :agl-distro:collabora_-_agl_sat_2021-03-18_-_app_framework.pdf  | Presentation from Daniel}} on App FW rework
+  * New topics:
+==== March 24, 2021  ====
+Attendees: Walt, Jan-Simon, Scott, Daniel, Hosokawa, Marius, Date, Stephane
+Reviewed the [[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WsFPh_-2wAYE8NvKlBGywYixhhJz9EBlbUR02r0UWF8/edit?usp=sharing | roadmap spreadsheet]] and added the tab "Copy of App FW and Security" to further refine and group the tasks.
   * New topics:

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